This episode of the MWI Podcast features a conversation with Craig Whiteside and Haroro Ingram. They are two of the three authors of a book called The ISIS Reader. It is a collection of primary sources about the Islamic State—speeches by the group’s leaders, written texts, and other formative documents—that, along with the analysis the authors provide, paint a detailed picture of the group’s origins and its evolution over the years.

We discuss that evolution in this episode, as well as whether such an understanding of ISIS better equips us to anticipate what form the organization might take in the future, the nature of the threat it might pose, and the regions that could be most vulnerable in the event of the group’s resurgence.

Listen to the full conversation below, and be sure to subscribe to the MWI Podcast wherever you get your podcasts—Apple PodcastsStitcher, Spotify, TuneIn, or your favorite podcast app.